Discussion:
A Look at the PC Junk Factor
(too old to reply)
Jake Clawson
2010-11-26 15:40:49 UTC
Permalink
From Tech Night Owl:

http://tinyurl.com/2bkkuqm

Cuss and discuss.

A Look at the PC Junk Factor
November 26th, 2010

On several occasions, Apple executives have been famously quoted as
saying, in response to questions about matching the prices of cheap PC
gear, that they didn’t know how to make junk. Of course, the critics
will usually claim Apple is run by a bunch of greedy so-and-sos and all
they want to do is extract as much cash from you as possible.

The skeptics will seldom admit that it’s not just a matter of a company
wanting to earn a decent profit, but to provide extra value for the
customers.

In contrast, most of the rest of the PC industry is busy flooding the
market with loads of sometimes barely different models in hopes that one
or two will catch fire and deliver decent sales. The netbook seems
mostly an attempt to get PC users to just sell something, anything,
during a time of economic downturn. At roughly $300 a pop, these
shrunken notebooks demonstrated no innovation whatever, just a rush to
the bottom and efforts to make something as cheaply as possible, without
regard to whether they even delivered satisfactory performance.

The netbook phenomenon, however, appears to have been short-lived. It
may be that the iPad’s arrival has made it obvious that, with a little
more money, a really usable computer can be bought. What’s more, PC
makers are beginning to offer supposedly full-featured portables for not
much more than a netbook, so the latter may be best offered for $200 or
less.

Now this is not a survey, but I did notice several netbooks on the
closeout counter at the local Sam’s Club, so maybe the point has been
reached where customers have begun to realize that Apple was right about
that cheap stuff all along.

Unfortunately, someone new to the PC marketplace, and there are such
people still, may not understand why a PC notebook can be sold for $400,
yet the cheapest MacBook or MacBook Air is $999. Just why is the Apple
so expensive?

Such suspicions may be compounded by the unfortunate efforts of our
largest product review publication, Consumer Reports. Now CR, as I’ve
said previously, prides itself as being incorruptible. They do not take
advertising from third parties, the magazine is published by a
non-profit corporation, and they buy all of the products they test in
retail outlets. Hence, there’s no opportunity for a manufacturer to
build a “trick” version that will work better than the units sold to
regular customers.

Of course, having reviewed electronics gear for years, I can tell you
from first-hand experience that I’ve never received a “ringer,” or
something I could be suspicious about. The very same defects that
afflict the shipping versions afflict the ones I’ve received direct from
the manufacturer or its marketing agency. Indeed, on some occasions, the
well-worn review sample may actually function worse.

Alas, CR also clouds the issue by comparing Macs with cheaper PC gear,
without regard to whether the core features, hardware configurations,
and bundled software,e are comparable. They fail to distinguish the
well-known differences between Mac OS X and Windows, and thus leave the
impression with their readers that there is no difference. The Mac is
just a pretty, overpriced PC.

In any case, it also seems clear that more and more people are realizing
that it’s better to pay for value than buy an inferior product that may
be less useful and perhaps fail quickly. That probably explains why
Apple’s sales have mostly grown faster than the competition in recent
years. Customer surveys tell the tale, demonstrating that large numbers
of people place Apple on the top of their shopping lists for the next
few months.

A recent NPD Group consumer survey, for example, revealed that some 11%
were planning to buy an iPad between now and February 2011. Just as
fascinating is the fact that use of the iPad appears to increase the
longer they’re owned. It grows from 15 hours a week after two months to
18 hours a week after three months.

I’m more curious about what these iPad owners are giving up. The PC?
Smartphones? Or do they just allocate more and more of their busy lives
to Apple’s newest iconic gadget?

Of course, this explains the rush by other companies to somehow steal
Apple’s thunder. In the PC space, that’s often done simply by using
cheaper parts, or removing features, but with tablets, Apple has already
set a price for the iPad that’s hard to beat.

What’s more, the customer is clearly not listening, as higher and higher
numbers of would-be buyers prefer Macs. According to a ChangeWave
survey, some 36% of buyers who plan to buy new notebooks in the next
three months expect to buy a Mac. Even more intriguing is the fact that
this level of interest has grown by 11% over the past month alone, which
may indicate that the updated MacBook Air might be a factor.

Or perhaps they are just having second thoughts about buying the cheap
junk far too many PC box assemblers continue to offer.
Percival P. Cassidy
2010-11-26 20:10:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jake Clawson
http://tinyurl.com/2bkkuqm
Cuss and discuss.
A Look at the PC Junk Factor
November 26th, 2010
<snip>

But it's not just either Apple or "junk." There are PCs that are not
junk and are built to last but are not sold at BestBuy or Walmart:
T-series (in particular) ThinkPads and Panasonic ToughBooks spring to
mind; and there are long-warranty higher-end Toshibas that probably are
not sold in those stores either.

Our student son's MacBook Pro came with only a one-year warranty, and we
paid extra to increase it to three years. During that time the mainboard
was replaced, and when I accompanied him to the Apple store to report
that the battery seemed to be losing capacity rather early I was
impressed with the courteousness of the technician who said it was still
just about within spec. but agreed to replace it anyway. Nevertheless I
could not help recalling how much we had paid up front for this service:
the comparatively high cost of the hardware and then the additional cost
of the extended warranty.

Perce
Craig Koller
2010-11-27 02:54:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Percival P. Cassidy
Post by Jake Clawson
http://tinyurl.com/2bkkuqm
Cuss and discuss.
A Look at the PC Junk Factor
November 26th, 2010
<snip>
But it's not just either Apple or "junk." There are PCs that are not
T-series (in particular) ThinkPads and Panasonic ToughBooks spring to
mind; and there are long-warranty higher-end Toshibas that probably are
not sold in those stores either.
Our student son's MacBook Pro came with only a one-year warranty, and we
paid extra to increase it to three years. During that time the mainboard
was replaced, and when I accompanied him to the Apple store to report
that the battery seemed to be losing capacity rather early I was
impressed with the courteousness of the technician who said it was still
just about within spec. but agreed to replace it anyway. Nevertheless I
the comparatively high cost of the hardware and then the additional cost
of the extended warranty.
Perce
In the end you have to ask yourself if Apple's worth it. If not,
thankfully there are other choices.

Anecdotally, my college son's 4-year-old, Craig's-list-purchased Macbook
Pro is still going strong.
John Slade
2010-11-27 02:50:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jake Clawson
http://tinyurl.com/2bkkuqm
Cuss and discuss.
A Look at the PC Junk Factor
November 26th, 2010
On several occasions, Apple executives have been famously quoted
as saying, in response to questions about matching the prices of
cheap PC gear, that they didn’t know how to make junk. Of
course, the critics will usually claim Apple is run by a bunch
of greedy so-and-sos and all they want to do is extract as much
cash from you as possible.
The skeptics will seldom admit that it’s not just a matter of a
company wanting to earn a decent profit, but to provide extra
value for the customers.
In contrast, most of the rest of the PC industry is busy
flooding the market with loads of sometimes barely different
models in hopes that one or two will catch fire and deliver
decent sales. The netbook seems mostly an attempt to get PC
users to just sell something, anything, during a time of
economic downturn. At roughly $300 a pop, these shrunken
notebooks demonstrated no innovation whatever, just a rush to
the bottom and efforts to make something as cheaply as possible,
without regard to whether they even delivered satisfactory
performance.
The netbook phenomenon, however, appears to have been
short-lived. It may be that the iPad’s arrival has made it
obvious that, with a little more money, a really usable computer
can be bought.
An iPad is not really a usable computer. It's more of a
novelty item with limited capacity. I think people are spending
the extra money on laptops. Most laptops are much more capable
than an iPad or other tablet device. They can run everything a
desktop computer can. Why would someone compromise and buy an
underpowered system like the iPad when a small laptop is cheaper
or around the same price. For what you pay for an iPad, you can
get a very good laptop. And the battery life is a non-issue
these days because 1) Apple's iPad battery life is about half
what they say and 2) Many laptops have bigger batteries these
days and some are using the polymer based batteries.

If you run "usable" applications on an iPad, the battery
life will be less than half what Apple claims.


John
Snit
2010-11-27 02:53:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Slade
Post by Jake Clawson
The netbook phenomenon, however, appears to have been
short-lived. It may be that the iPad¹s arrival has made it
obvious that, with a little more money, a really usable computer
can be bought.
An iPad is not really a usable computer. It's more of a
novelty item with limited capacity.
How do you define "novelty item" as you are using the term?
Post by John Slade
I think people are spending the extra money on laptops. Most laptops are much
more capable than an iPad or other tablet device.
Yet people are playing with other people's iPods and then rushing to get
their own. Interesting.
Post by John Slade
They can run everything a desktop computer can. Why would someone compromise
and buy an underpowered system like the iPad when a small laptop is cheaper or
around the same price.
Because the iPad serves them better.
Post by John Slade
For what you pay for an iPad, you can get a very good laptop. And the battery
life is a non-issue these days because 1) Apple's iPad battery life is about
half what they say
And your evidence of this is... damn. You lost it.
Post by John Slade
and 2) Many laptops have bigger batteries these days and some are using the
polymer based batteries.
Which has a comparable battery life? Please point to the model.
Post by John Slade
If you run "usable" applications on an iPad, the battery life will be less
than half what Apple claims.
What apps are not "usable"? In any case, please do support your claim.

But you will not. This is 100% predictable.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Craig Koller
2010-11-27 05:22:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Slade
Post by Jake Clawson
http://tinyurl.com/2bkkuqm
Cuss and discuss.
A Look at the PC Junk Factor
November 26th, 2010
On several occasions, Apple executives have been famously quoted
as saying, in response to questions about matching the prices of
cheap PC gear, that they didn¹t know how to make junk. Of
course, the critics will usually claim Apple is run by a bunch
of greedy so-and-sos and all they want to do is extract as much
cash from you as possible.
The skeptics will seldom admit that it¹s not just a matter of a
company wanting to earn a decent profit, but to provide extra
value for the customers.
In contrast, most of the rest of the PC industry is busy
flooding the market with loads of sometimes barely different
models in hopes that one or two will catch fire and deliver
decent sales. The netbook seems mostly an attempt to get PC
users to just sell something, anything, during a time of
economic downturn. At roughly $300 a pop, these shrunken
notebooks demonstrated no innovation whatever, just a rush to
the bottom and efforts to make something as cheaply as possible,
without regard to whether they even delivered satisfactory
performance.
The netbook phenomenon, however, appears to have been
short-lived. It may be that the iPad¹s arrival has made it
obvious that, with a little more money, a really usable computer
can be bought.
An iPad is not really a usable computer.
Tell that to the millions of iPad users happily using their usable iPads.
Post by John Slade
It's more of a novelty item with limited capacity.
For people carrying iPods, Kindles, organizers, laptops and cell phones
(not to mention older users with eyesight issues) the iPad not only
consolidates technology but makes it easier to use.
Post by John Slade
I think people are spending
the extra money on laptops. Most laptops are much more capable
than an iPad or other tablet device. They can run everything a
desktop computer can. Why would someone compromise and buy an
underpowered system like the iPad when a small laptop is cheaper
or around the same price.
The iPad is damn zippy. Maybe that's the SSD storage, but you don't
really wait on much with an iPad. And with 4.2 it just got a whole lot
better.
Post by John Slade
For what you pay for an iPad, you can
get a very good laptop. And the battery life is a non-issue
these days because 1) Apple's iPad battery life is about half
what they say and 2) Many laptops have bigger batteries these
days and some are using the polymer based batteries.
If you run "usable" applications on an iPad, the battery
life will be less than half what Apple claims.
John
You sound like you don't have an iPad.

First, the battery life is as good as Apple reports (even for serious
apps) which means, unlike with a laptop, you don't have to go to a
meeting and try and find a power outlet any more. You'd be surprised how
this lowers anxiety levels.

Second, iOS offers the perfect amount of functionality for most "normal"
users. Throw in a bluetooth keyboard and you go 90% of the way for
document creation, which is more than enough for the regular crowd.

Third, it's light and thin. It's crazy light for what it does. Any other
laptop, you'll stick in a bag and schlep. The iPad, you just bring like
you would a Franklin planner, only it's less bulky.

Fourth, you're right that there's some novelty there. But go to any
airport, any trade show, any executive confab and you'll see these
things all over, just like you did Blackberries 6-7 years ago. What's
more, anyone with an iPod or iPhone gets to migrate their apps over to
the iPad as well. People like this.

Fifth, and this is important. The iPad is changing people's expectations
about what an app should do and cost. For $15 you can get an app suite
like Docs2Go that does 90% of what most people do with MS Office for
$150. Pages, Numbers and Keynote are $10 a piece.

Light, thin, fast and efficient matter. That's why the new MacBook Air
is leveraging this (halo effect) to draw sales at the top end, where
"cheap" isn't as important. You couldn't ask for better viral marketing.
Aspirational users watch affluent users and will find a way to get in.
Windows leveraged this for nearly 20 years when it grabbed the C suite
from IBM and quickly made people fear being "left out" unless they opted
for the blessed solution at home.

Cuts both ways.

And unlike the old MS/Apple shakeout in the past, down the road there's
Nokia, BB, Google, Apple, HP and MS. It'll be interesting.
John Slade
2010-11-27 19:21:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
Post by Jake Clawson
http://tinyurl.com/2bkkuqm
Cuss and discuss.
A Look at the PC Junk Factor
November 26th, 2010
On several occasions, Apple executives have been famously quoted
as saying, in response to questions about matching the prices of
cheap PC gear, that they didn¹t know how to make junk. Of
course, the critics will usually claim Apple is run by a bunch
of greedy so-and-sos and all they want to do is extract as much
cash from you as possible.
The skeptics will seldom admit that it¹s not just a matter of a
company wanting to earn a decent profit, but to provide extra
value for the customers.
In contrast, most of the rest of the PC industry is busy
flooding the market with loads of sometimes barely different
models in hopes that one or two will catch fire and deliver
decent sales. The netbook seems mostly an attempt to get PC
users to just sell something, anything, during a time of
economic downturn. At roughly $300 a pop, these shrunken
notebooks demonstrated no innovation whatever, just a rush to
the bottom and efforts to make something as cheaply as possible,
without regard to whether they even delivered satisfactory
performance.
The netbook phenomenon, however, appears to have been
short-lived. It may be that the iPad¹s arrival has made it
obvious that, with a little more money, a really usable computer
can be bought.
An iPad is not really a usable computer.
Tell that to the millions of iPad users happily using their usable iPads.
I didn't say the iPad wasn't usable, I said it was
unusable as a
computer. Tell me this, how many laptops were sold last year and
how many iPads were sold last year?
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
It's more of a novelty item with limited capacity.
For people carrying iPods, Kindles, organizers, laptops and cell phones
(not to mention older users with eyesight issues) the iPad not only
consolidates technology but makes it easier to use.
But the thing is, the iPad doesn't do computing well.
Also people with eyesight issues might not want to use the iPad
because of it's short battery life when you turn the brightness
up on the screen. Laptops merge all the things that the iPad
does and ads a few things.
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
I think people are spending
the extra money on laptops. Most laptops are much more capable
than an iPad or other tablet device. They can run everything a
desktop computer can. Why would someone compromise and buy an
underpowered system like the iPad when a small laptop is cheaper
or around the same price.
The iPad is damn zippy. Maybe that's the SSD storage, but you don't
really wait on much with an iPad. And with 4.2 it just got a whole lot
better.
Try running a full fledged FPS shooter game on a tablet
like the iPad and then try it on a laptop. The iPad has
simplistic, low-power graphics with little video memory. That's
done to extend battery life. Nobody is thinking of using an iPad
to do serious computing. That's what makes the iPad a novelty
item like other tablets and e-book readers. One exception is the
Slate from HP that actually has a fast CPU and is built for
serious computing. It's aimed at the enterprise market.
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
For what you pay for an iPad, you can
get a very good laptop. And the battery life is a non-issue
these days because 1) Apple's iPad battery life is about half
what they say and 2) Many laptops have bigger batteries these
days and some are using the polymer based batteries.
If you run "usable" applications on an iPad, the battery
life will be less than half what Apple claims.
John
You sound like you don't have an iPad.
<massive nonsense snippage>

I don't have an iPad because I don't need one. This is
why it's a novelty item. The iPad is not practical as a
computer. You can't even easily put your choice of OS on it. I
have seen laptops that cost less than an iPad that allows you to
install your choice of OS. If you do this with an iPad, you'll
probably make Steve Jobs so pissed off he comes knocking on your
door.

John
Snit
2010-11-27 20:33:42 UTC
Permalink
John Slade stated in post 4TcIo.39038$***@newsfe21.iad on 11/27/10
12:21 PM:

...
Post by Craig Koller
Tell that to the millions of iPad users happily using their usable iPads.
I didn't say the iPad wasn't usable, I said it was unusable as a computer.
Yet it is a computer... and many people use it very well. I accept, though,
that you cannot imagine yourself using a computer well.
Tell me this, how many laptops were sold last year and how many iPads were
sold last year?
Ah, compare a *product* with a whole class of products. Yeah, that makes
sense. LOL!
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
It's more of a novelty item with limited capacity.
For people carrying iPods, Kindles, organizers, laptops and cell phones
(not to mention older users with eyesight issues) the iPad not only
consolidates technology but makes it easier to use.
But the thing is, the iPad doesn't do computing well.
Sure it does. It fulfills its goals very well. It is not a desktop
computer - nor meant to be one.
Also people with eyesight issues might not want to use the iPad
because of it's short battery life when you turn the brightness
up on the screen. Laptops merge all the things that the iPad
does and ads a few things.
The iPad has a pretty long battery life. Oh, and a laptop does not do what
the iPad does. The closest to it is likely the MacBook Air.
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
I think people are spending
the extra money on laptops. Most laptops are much more capable
than an iPad or other tablet device. They can run everything a
desktop computer can. Why would someone compromise and buy an
underpowered system like the iPad when a small laptop is cheaper
or around the same price.
The iPad is damn zippy. Maybe that's the SSD storage, but you don't
really wait on much with an iPad. And with 4.2 it just got a whole lot
better.
Try running a full fledged FPS shooter game on a tablet
like the iPad and then try it on a laptop. The iPad has
simplistic, low-power graphics with little video memory. That's
done to extend battery life. Nobody is thinking of using an iPad
to do serious computing.
LOL! Two things funny with this:

1) Your "example" of serious computing is a FPS game.

2) You think people buy portable computers to do "serious computing".

Is there anything about the computer market you *do* understand?
That's what makes the iPad a novelty item like other tablets and e-book
readers.
Ah, this is how you define "novelty item" - not able to do "serious
computing"... as shown by FPS games. LOL!

Oh, and there are FPS games on the iPad... even the iPhone!

<http://www.appadvice.com/appguides/show/best-iphone-shooter-games>

Now you know.
One exception is the Slate from HP that actually has a fast CPU and
is built for serious computing. It's aimed at the enterprise market.
How many have sold compared to the iPad? Just curious. LOL!
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
For what you pay for an iPad, you can
get a very good laptop. And the battery life is a non-issue
these days because 1) Apple's iPad battery life is about half
what they say and 2) Many laptops have bigger batteries these
days and some are using the polymer based batteries.
If you run "usable" applications on an iPad, the battery
life will be less than half what Apple claims.
John
You sound like you don't have an iPad.
<massive nonsense snippage>
I don't have an iPad because I don't need one.
And you clearly know nothing about them.
This is why it's a novelty item.
Ah, your next definition of "novelty item" - you do not have one. LOL!
The iPad is not practical as a computer.
Not as a desktop replacement. I suspect that is what you mean.
You can't even easily put your choice of OS on it.
So? It is not advertised that you can.
I have seen laptops that cost less than an iPad that allows you to install
your choice of OS.
Ah, yes, that is why people buy computers - to install OSs. OK, you go
Apple there - the iPad is not good for that task. Man, that really sucks
given how many people spend all day just installing OSs for fun.
If you do this with an iPad, you'll probably make Steve
Jobs so pissed off he comes knocking on your door.
John
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Craig Koller
2010-11-28 03:27:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Slade
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
Post by Jake Clawson
http://tinyurl.com/2bkkuqm
Cuss and discuss.
A Look at the PC Junk Factor
November 26th, 2010
On several occasions, Apple executives have been famously quoted
as saying, in response to questions about matching the prices of
cheap PC gear, that they didn¹t know how to make junk. Of
course, the critics will usually claim Apple is run by a bunch
of greedy so-and-sos and all they want to do is extract as much
cash from you as possible.
The skeptics will seldom admit that it¹s not just a matter of a
company wanting to earn a decent profit, but to provide extra
value for the customers.
In contrast, most of the rest of the PC industry is busy
flooding the market with loads of sometimes barely different
models in hopes that one or two will catch fire and deliver
decent sales. The netbook seems mostly an attempt to get PC
users to just sell something, anything, during a time of
economic downturn. At roughly $300 a pop, these shrunken
notebooks demonstrated no innovation whatever, just a rush to
the bottom and efforts to make something as cheaply as possible,
without regard to whether they even delivered satisfactory
performance.
The netbook phenomenon, however, appears to have been
short-lived. It may be that the iPad¹s arrival has made it
obvious that, with a little more money, a really usable computer
can be bought.
An iPad is not really a usable computer.
Tell that to the millions of iPad users happily using their usable iPads.
I didn't say the iPad wasn't usable, I said it was
unusable as a
computer. Tell me this, how many laptops were sold last year and
how many iPads were sold last year?
The iPad didn't even exist until April of this year. Laptops have had a
20-year head start.
Post by John Slade
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
It's more of a novelty item with limited capacity.
For people carrying iPods, Kindles, organizers, laptops and cell phones
(not to mention older users with eyesight issues) the iPad not only
consolidates technology but makes it easier to use.
But the thing is, the iPad doesn't do computing well.
Also people with eyesight issues might not want to use the iPad
because of it's short battery life when you turn the brightness
up on the screen. Laptops merge all the things that the iPad
does and ads a few things.
You'll get a full day's use with full brightness. Use one and you'd know
this.
Post by John Slade
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
I think people are spending
the extra money on laptops. Most laptops are much more capable
than an iPad or other tablet device. They can run everything a
desktop computer can. Why would someone compromise and buy an
underpowered system like the iPad when a small laptop is cheaper
or around the same price.
The iPad is damn zippy. Maybe that's the SSD storage, but you don't
really wait on much with an iPad. And with 4.2 it just got a whole lot
better.
Try running a full fledged FPS shooter game on a tablet
like the iPad and then try it on a laptop. The iPad has
simplistic, low-power graphics with little video memory. That's
done to extend battery life. Nobody is thinking of using an iPad
to do serious computing. That's what makes the iPad a novelty
item like other tablets and e-book readers. One exception is the
Slate from HP that actually has a fast CPU and is built for
serious computing. It's aimed at the enterprise market.
For hard-core computer users, yes. That's a minority of computer users.
You're imposing your sensibilities on a much larger market that simply
wants to accomplish tasks without carrying around a laptop.
Post by John Slade
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
For what you pay for an iPad, you can
get a very good laptop. And the battery life is a non-issue
these days because 1) Apple's iPad battery life is about half
what they say and 2) Many laptops have bigger batteries these
days and some are using the polymer based batteries.
If you run "usable" applications on an iPad, the battery
life will be less than half what Apple claims.
John
You sound like you don't have an iPad.
<massive nonsense snippage>
I don't have an iPad because I don't need one.
My point is that you speak with definitive authority about something you
obviously haven't used. The value of the iPad isn't it's ability just to
act like a computer but to rather handle the activities of not only a
computer, but phones, MP3 players, portable gaming devices, readers,
video players ... all in one unit.

This is
Post by John Slade
why it's a novelty item. The iPad is not practical as a
computer.
So you say. Again, there are many opinions beyond mine that roundly
disagree.
Post by John Slade
You can't even easily put your choice of OS on it. I
have seen laptops that cost less than an iPad that allows you to
install your choice of OS. If you do this with an iPad, you'll
probably make Steve Jobs so pissed off he comes knocking on your
door.
John
Tommy the Troll
2010-11-28 18:29:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Slade
I don't have an iPad because I don't need one. This is
why it's a novelty item. The iPad is not practical as a
computer. You can't even easily put your choice of OS on it. I
have seen laptops that cost less than an iPad that allows you to
install your choice of OS. If you do this with an iPad, you'll
probably make Steve Jobs so pissed off he comes knocking on your
door.
John
Try it, and it will be bricked.
ZnU
2010-11-28 20:17:59 UTC
Permalink
[snip]
Post by John Slade
Post by Craig Koller
Tell that to the millions of iPad users happily using their usable iPads.
I didn't say the iPad wasn't usable, I said it was
unusable as a computer. Tell me this, how many laptops were sold last
year and how many iPads were sold last year?
Zero iPads were sold last yeast. It wasn't on sale yet. You buffoon.
Post by John Slade
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
It's more of a novelty item with limited capacity.
For people carrying iPods, Kindles, organizers, laptops and cell phones
(not to mention older users with eyesight issues) the iPad not only
consolidates technology but makes it easier to use.
But the thing is, the iPad doesn't do computing well.
Vague nonsense.
Post by John Slade
Also people with eyesight issues might not want to use the iPad
because of it's short battery life when you turn the brightness
up on the screen. Laptops merge all the things that the iPad
does and ads a few things.
Please document this "short battery life when you turn the brightness up
on the screen".
Post by John Slade
Post by Craig Koller
Post by John Slade
I think people are spending
the extra money on laptops. Most laptops are much more capable
than an iPad or other tablet device. They can run everything a
desktop computer can. Why would someone compromise and buy an
underpowered system like the iPad when a small laptop is cheaper
or around the same price.
The iPad is damn zippy. Maybe that's the SSD storage, but you don't
really wait on much with an iPad. And with 4.2 it just got a whole lot
better.
Try running a full fledged FPS shooter game on a tablet
like the iPad and then try it on a laptop.
Seriously? FPS games? Your concept of the priorities of normal consumers
has zero relationship whatsoever to reality.

Admit it, this "John Slade" persona is an elaborate parody, right?

[snip]
--
"The game of professional investment is intolerably boring and over-exacting to
anyone who is entirely exempt from the gambling instinct; whilst he who has it
must pay to this propensity the appropriate toll." -- John Maynard Keynes
Tim Murray
2010-12-04 01:29:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Slade
I don't have an iPad because I don't need one. This is
why it's a novelty item.
You think pretty highly of yourself.
Tim Murray
2010-12-04 01:38:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Slade
Tell me this, how many laptops were sold last year and
how many iPads were sold last year?
iPad was announced July 2010, idiot. During Q2 Apple sold over 4 million.
700,000 sold opening day.

Your point?
Tommy the Troll
2010-11-27 15:00:28 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 09:40:49 -0600, Jake Clawson
Post by Jake Clawson
In any case, it also seems clear that more and more people are realizing
that it’s better to pay for value than buy an inferior product that may
be less useful and perhaps fail quickly. That probably explains why
Apple’s sales have mostly grown faster than the competition in recent
years. Customer surveys tell the tale, demonstrating that large numbers
of people place Apple on the top of their shopping lists for the next
few months.
Ha ha.

Growing not in the PC space, only in the phone and gadget space.
Windows 7 is currently increasing share as much in 3 months as Mac has
gathered in 25 years. Mac share of Web hits is either stable or
declining, depending on the source you use. If anything, a higher
percent of Macs sales are Mac replacement machines than is the case
for Windows.

Windows use is keeping pace with Mac use, and sales of new W7 machines
is doing very well.

If the author was right, Windows use would be falling as all that
"junk" he claims were true.

BTW, does anyone but me remember how the Maccies were shouting from
the rooftops about NetMarketshare numbers for Mac before they started
weighting the hits by country? Now that NetMarketshare is not looking
so great for Mac, the Maccies poop on their numbers.
Dirk T. Verbeek
2010-11-28 16:03:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 09:40:49 -0600, Jake Clawson
Post by Jake Clawson
In any case, it also seems clear that more and more people are realizing
that it’s better to pay for value than buy an inferior product that may
be less useful and perhaps fail quickly. That probably explains why
Apple’s sales have mostly grown faster than the competition in recent
years. Customer surveys tell the tale, demonstrating that large numbers
of people place Apple on the top of their shopping lists for the next
few months.
Ha ha.
Growing not in the PC space, only in the phone and gadget space.
Windows 7 is currently increasing share as much in 3 months as Mac has
gathered in 25 years. Mac share of Web hits is either stable or
declining, depending on the source you use.
Yeah right.
But buying a Mac is a conscious decision, Win7 is included with the PC
even when you really don't want it you still have to pay what's so aptly
called the Microsoft Tax.
Post by Tommy the Troll
If anything, a higher
percent of Macs sales are Mac replacement machines than is the case
for Windows.
Meaning their users are happy with them.
Post by Tommy the Troll
Windows use is keeping pace with Mac use, and sales of new W7 machines
is doing very well.
See above, it's forced on you, I prefer to install an operating system
of MY choice but I still have to pay for Windows.
Post by Tommy the Troll
If the author was right, Windows use would be falling as all that
"junk" he claims were true.
The changes you are referring to are so marginal that they mean very
little to nothing.
Post by Tommy the Troll
BTW, does anyone but me remember how the Maccies were shouting from
the rooftops about NetMarketshare numbers for Mac before they started
weighting the hits by country? Now that NetMarketshare is not looking
so great for Mac, the Maccies poop on their numbers.
Tommy the Troll
2010-11-28 17:28:46 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:03:53 +0100, "Dirk T. Verbeek"
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 09:40:49 -0600, Jake Clawson
Post by Jake Clawson
In any case, it also seems clear that more and more people are realizing
that it’s better to pay for value than buy an inferior product that may
be less useful and perhaps fail quickly. That probably explains why
Apple’s sales have mostly grown faster than the competition in recent
years. Customer surveys tell the tale, demonstrating that large numbers
of people place Apple on the top of their shopping lists for the next
few months.
Ha ha.
Growing not in the PC space, only in the phone and gadget space.
Windows 7 is currently increasing share as much in 3 months as Mac has
gathered in 25 years. Mac share of Web hits is either stable or
declining, depending on the source you use.
Yeah right.
But buying a Mac is a conscious decision, Win7 is included with the PC
even when you really don't want it you still have to pay what's so aptly
called the Microsoft Tax.
Buying a Windows machine is also a conscious decision. In Best Buy the
2 departments are adjoining.
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
If anything, a higher
percent of Macs sales are Mac replacement machines than is the case
for Windows.
Meaning their users are happy with them.
No, it means that pre-2006 PPC Macs are turning into useless bricks
with no upgrade path.
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
Windows use is keeping pace with Mac use, and sales of new W7 machines
is doing very well.
See above, it's forced on you, I prefer to install an operating system
of MY choice but I still have to pay for Windows.
So, buy a Mac and install the OS of your choice. Or, build your own.
Dirk T. Verbeek
2010-11-28 19:28:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:03:53 +0100, "Dirk T. Verbeek"
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 09:40:49 -0600, Jake Clawson
<snip>
Post by Tommy the Troll
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
If anything, a higher
percent of Macs sales are Mac replacement machines than is the case
for Windows.
Meaning their users are happy with them.
No, it means that pre-2006 PPC Macs are turning into useless bricks
with no upgrade path.
Exactly the reason I would not buy into such a closed environment.
Post by Tommy the Troll
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
Windows use is keeping pace with Mac use, and sales of new W7 machines
is doing very well.
See above, it's forced on you, I prefer to install an operating system
of MY choice but I still have to pay for Windows.
So, buy a Mac and install the OS of your choice. Or, build your own.
Ever more PC's sold are laptops and netbooks.
Building your own laptop is near-impossible.
Buying a laptop without an OS is also near impossible or at least
expensive and you get little choice.
Running a Hackintosh is strongly frowned upon by Apple.

It's time legislation brings back freedom of choice for the consumer.
Chance Furlong
2010-11-29 18:58:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:03:53 +0100, "Dirk T. Verbeek"
So, buy a Mac and install the OS of your choice. Or, build your own.
Ever more PC's sold are laptops and netbooks.
Building your own laptop is near-impossible.
Buying a laptop without an OS is also near impossible or at least
expensive and you get little choice.
Running a Hackintosh is strongly frowned upon by Apple.
It's time legislation brings back freedom of choice for the consumer.
But freedom of choice is anathema to Bill Gated and Steve "Monkey Boy"
Ballmer
Uncle Max
2010-11-29 22:55:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:03:53 +0100, "Dirk T. Verbeek"
So, buy a Mac and install the OS of your choice. Or, build your own.
Ever more PC's sold are laptops and netbooks.
Building your own laptop is near-impossible.
Buying a laptop without an OS is also near impossible or at least
expensive and you get little choice.
Running a Hackintosh is strongly frowned upon by Apple.
It's time legislation brings back freedom of choice for the consumer.
But freedom of choice is anathema to Bill Gated and Steve "Monkey Boy"
Ballmer

Is "Monkey Boy" the same as "Hamster Boy"? Do you suk monkey dik?
Tim Murray
2010-12-04 01:41:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Uncle Max
Is "Monkey Boy" the same as "Hamster Boy"? Do you suk monkey dik?
How many socks do you own, zara?

Uncle Max
2010-11-29 22:55:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:03:53 +0100, "Dirk T. Verbeek"
So, buy a Mac and install the OS of your choice. Or, build your own.
Ever more PC's sold are laptops and netbooks.
Building your own laptop is near-impossible.
Buying a laptop without an OS is also near impossible or at least
expensive and you get little choice.
Running a Hackintosh is strongly frowned upon by Apple.
It's time legislation brings back freedom of choice for the consumer.
But freedom of choice is anathema to Bill Gated and Steve "Monkey Boy"
Ballmer

Is "Monkey Boy" the same as "Hamster Boy"? Do you suk monkey dik?
Chance Furlong
2010-11-30 00:47:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:03:53 +0100, "Dirk T. Verbeek"
So, buy a Mac and install the OS of your choice. Or, build your own.
Ever more PC's sold are laptops and netbooks.
Building your own laptop is near-impossible.
Buying a laptop without an OS is also near impossible or at least
expensive and you get little choice.
Running a Hackintosh is strongly frowned upon by Apple.
It's time legislation brings back freedom of choice for the consumer.
But freedom of choice is anathema to Bill Gates and Steve "Monkey Boy" Ballmer.
Is "Monkey Boy" the same as "Hamster Boy?"
No, sorry, zara.
Do you suk monkey dick?
No again, zara. Sorry to disappoint you.
Uncle Max
2010-11-30 02:03:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:03:53 +0100, "Dirk T. Verbeek"
So, buy a Mac and install the OS of your choice. Or, build your own.
Ever more PC's sold are laptops and netbooks.
Building your own laptop is near-impossible.
Buying a laptop without an OS is also near impossible or at least
expensive and you get little choice.
Running a Hackintosh is strongly frowned upon by Apple.
It's time legislation brings back freedom of choice for the consumer.
But freedom of choice is anathema to Bill Gates and Steve "Monkey Boy" Ballmer.
Is "Monkey Boy" the same as "Hamster Boy?"
No, sorry, zara.
Do you suk monkey dick?
No again, zara. Sorry to disappoint you.

That's somebody else sorry to disappoint you. Do u suk monkey dik?
Uncle Max
2010-11-29 22:55:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:03:53 +0100, "Dirk T. Verbeek"
So, buy a Mac and install the OS of your choice. Or, build your own.
Ever more PC's sold are laptops and netbooks.
Building your own laptop is near-impossible.
Buying a laptop without an OS is also near impossible or at least
expensive and you get little choice.
Running a Hackintosh is strongly frowned upon by Apple.
It's time legislation brings back freedom of choice for the consumer.
But freedom of choice is anathema to Bill Gated and Steve "Monkey Boy"
Ballmer

Is "Monkey Boy" the same as "Hamster Boy"? Do you suk monkey dik?
Uncle Max
2010-11-29 22:55:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:03:53 +0100, "Dirk T. Verbeek"
So, buy a Mac and install the OS of your choice. Or, build your own.
Ever more PC's sold are laptops and netbooks.
Building your own laptop is near-impossible.
Buying a laptop without an OS is also near impossible or at least
expensive and you get little choice.
Running a Hackintosh is strongly frowned upon by Apple.
It's time legislation brings back freedom of choice for the consumer.
But freedom of choice is anathema to Bill Gated and Steve "Monkey Boy"
Ballmer

Is "Monkey Boy" the same as "Hamster Boy"? Do you suk monkey dik?
Justin
2010-11-30 01:31:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Percival P. Cassidy
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:03:53 +0100, "Dirk T. Verbeek"
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 09:40:49 -0600, Jake Clawson
<snip>
Post by Tommy the Troll
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
If anything, a higher
percent of Macs sales are Mac replacement machines than is the case
for Windows.
Meaning their users are happy with them.
No, it means that pre-2006 PPC Macs are turning into useless bricks
with no upgrade path.
Exactly the reason I would not buy into such a closed environment.
Post by Tommy the Troll
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
Post by Tommy the Troll
Windows use is keeping pace with Mac use, and sales of new W7 machines
is doing very well.
See above, it's forced on you, I prefer to install an operating system
of MY choice but I still have to pay for Windows.
So, buy a Mac and install the OS of your choice. Or, build your own.
Ever more PC's sold are laptops and netbooks.
Building your own laptop is near-impossible.
Buying a laptop without an OS is also near impossible or at least
expensive and you get little choice.
Running a Hackintosh is strongly frowned upon by Apple.
It's time legislation brings back freedom of choice for the consumer.
Quite the contrary, the last thing the market needs is government
intervention.
How can you legislate freedom of choice into the market? Increase the
sales tax on MS products by 1%?
Serious question, I can't think of a way for the government to interfere
and increase the amount of freedom consumers have.
Dirk T. Verbeek
2010-11-30 15:24:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Justin
Post by Dirk T. Verbeek
It's time legislation brings back freedom of choice for the consumer.
Quite the contrary, the last thing the market needs is government
intervention.
How can you legislate freedom of choice into the market? Increase the
sales tax on MS products by 1%?
Serious question, I can't think of a way for the government to interfere
and increase the amount of freedom consumers have.
Simple, have a good look at the contracts that force the sale of an OS
with the hardware, that kind of collusion should be illegal.
Microsoft has been declared a monopoly and as such it has to live by
standards not necessarily expected from small players.
Chance Furlong
2010-11-29 19:00:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tommy the Troll
So, buy a Mac and install the OS of your choice. Or, build your own.
Instaaling OS X on non Apple hardware is against the EULA, or are you
too dense to have known that? Being dense is typical of Windroids and
Microsoft advocates.
Loading...